(So here we pick up pretty much where we left off, with some preliminaries eliminted ...)
Question: So how is it that Nazi ships were forced to sail for the Graditch Chax?
ANSWER: IT IS ONLY KNOWN THAT THEY DID SO.
Question: What happened to the resurrected Troll King and any survivors on Krupp?
ANSWER: I DON’T KNOW. KRUPP IS AVOIDED NOW.
Question: Could the Troll King and his minions still be there?
ANSWER: IT IS GENERALLY BELIEVED THAT WHICH HAS ITS ORIGIN INSIDE MINNESOTA CANNOT EXIST OUTSIDE OF MINNESOTA FOR LONG.
Question: Yes, you said this before. So the hope was that anything remaining on Krupp just went away on its own, and at any rate, Krupp was now a burned out cinder island of toxicity and terror in a remote area of the ocean?
ANSWER: YES.
Question: So you say one of the Nazi ships ran aground in the Graditch Chax. Did the surviving sailors have to swim the Chax to get to shore and safety?
ANSWER: OBVIOUSLY.
Question: So this shows, at least, that one can encounter the waters of the Chax, even swim in them, and survive, right?
ANSWER: SURVIVE, YES.
Question: Do you have something more to say?
ANSWER: SOME OF THEM TURNED UP IN AMERICAN SOCIETY, SOME OF THEM TOLD THEIR STORY AT SOCMAL CONCLAVES. BUT THEY WERE TOUCHED.
(Note: I Have briefly mentioned the subject of the conclaves before, but as a reminder, this is the primary way that news is spread in American society. People gather at ongoing public forums, which are called “conclaves.” They operate basically informally, and 24/7 and people come and go as they please. Sometimes, apparently, the conclaves are crowded with people when there is much news, at other times, they are sparsely attended. News of the nation and world is obtained first hand from an ongoing line of speakers or “citizen reporters” who have news to share.)
Question: Dr. 58, what do you mean when you say that those who encountered the waters of the Chax are ‘touched.’?
ANSWER: WITH ALL MANNER OF MADNESS. MALADJUSTMENTS. SOME BECOME ACOLYTES OF OLD CAVE.
Question: How interesting. So this Old Cave, the former Father Reston Vromin, seems to be quite a remarkable individual. He almost certainly spent a number of years in Minnesota were he lost his faith. On the other hand, he seems to have somehow assimilated his experience, and was able to become a wise teacher of sorts, if also slightly mad, correct?
ANSWER: YES.
Question: And what you’re saying is that people, such as those poor Nazi’s who were so traumatized on Krupp, and then encountered the enchanted waters of the Graditch Chax, were able to come to Father Vromin for some kind of help is living out the rest of their lives, despite being touched by the ultimate strangeness of Minnesota power?
ANSWER: YES, EXACTLY.
Question: What happened to the Nazi naval vessel that grounded in the Graditch Chax?
ANSWER: IT IS BELIEVED THAT GOVERNMENT OFFICIALS OBSERVED IT FROM AFAR WITH POWERFUL OPTICS. THE SHIP IS GONE NOW, BUT THE CIRCUMSTANCES ARE SUBJECT OF MUCH RUMOR.
Question: What are one of the rumors surrounding the disappearance of the ship from the Chax?
ANSWER: THE GOVERNMENT KNOWS THE TRUTH BUT DOES NOT TELL. THE RUMOR IS THAT THE SHIP WAS DISMANTLED BY IMPS AND CARRIED PIECE-BY-PIECE INTO MINNESOTA.
Question: Imps, you say? What are those?
ANSWER: IMPS.
Question: Okay. But this is mostly rumor anyway?
ANSWER: OLD CAVE SAYS THAT REFINED METALS ARE OF EXTREME VALUE IN SOME PARTS OF MINNESOTA. THEY DON’T HAVE REFINED METAL.
Question: Does Old Cave speak of encounters with Imps?
ANSWER: YES.
Question: They don’t have refined metals in Minnesota? You mean like steel, or copper or gold or silver?
ANSWER: WHAT EXISTS WITHIN MINNESOTA IS BROUGHT IN FROM THE OUTSIDE.
Question: Is this what Father Vromin, excuse me, Old Cave, says?
ANSWER: YES. THE REFINING OF METALS IS TECHNOLOGICAL. MINNESOTA IS NOT TECHNOLOGICAL.
Question: Well, does this know-it-all Father Vromin, AKA Old Cave, know why refined metals are so valuable in Minnesota?
ANSWER: THERE ARE ASPECTS OF SOCIETY INSIDE MINNESOTA THAT FAVOR THE ACQUISITION OF REFINED METALS.
Question: Why?
ANSWER: I DON’T KNOW.
Question: So that’s interesting when you say there are ’aspect of society’ inside Minnesota. To this point, we have had the impression that whatever goes on inside Minnesota is like some gigantic, all-encompassing irrational nightmare. What do you think?
ANSWER: THERE ARE ASPECTS OF RATIONAL SOCIETY INSIDE MINNESOTA, ACCORDING TO OLD CAVE, AND OTHERS.
Question: Like what, for example?
ANSWER: OLD CAVE SAYS THERE ARE ORGANIZED SOCIETIES, VILLAGES, FORTIFIED COMPOUNDS, FORTS, CASTLES KEEPS, AND MORE.
Question: Wow, that sounds intriguing. And are these organized societies populated with human beings, or what?
ANSWER: YES. OLD CAVE SAID MINNESOTA HAS PEOPLE, MORE HUMAN PEOPLE THAN OTHER SPECIES OF BEINGS.
Question: I wonder, does Old Cave happen to carry a staff?
ANSWER: YES.
Question: Ho, ho! I bet that Old Cave at one time encountered a member of the Staff Guild while he was in Minnesota, perhaps even Gefraim, whom you and I have had a conversation with. What do you think?
ANSWER: THAT SEEMS REASONABLE.
Question: Have you ever asked Old Cave about meeting a member of the Staff Guild?
ANSWER: NO.
Question: Just how well do you know Old Cave, Dr. 58. Are you a good friend, or a member of his inner circle?
ANSWER: NO. I ATTEND HIS LECTURES, OR LISTEN TO HIS STREET RAVINGS. I HAVE BEEN TO SOME SECRET SOCMAL TEACHINGS.
Question: I’m wondering, would it be possible for me to speak with Old Cave?
ANSWER: I DON’T KNOW.
Question: Well, could you bring him to wherever you have this super secret Hassas Grid contraption set up, I presume in some illegal back-alley warehouse somewhere?
ANSWER: I DON’T KNOW EXACTLY WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT.
Question: Forget it. Anyway, I must say, you seem to be growing a bit bolder, Dr. 58. I can imagine that just admitting that you went to a secret socmal meeting with Old Cave is highly illegal. When we first started speaking, you often expressed your fear over the illegality of even speaking of this kind of thing? What do you say?
ANSWER: I NOW THINK IT DOUBTFUL THE GOVERNMENT CAN ACCESS THE HASSAS GRID.
Question: What makes you think that?
ANSWER: EXPERIENCE.
Question: Old Cave must be rather bold as well. For someone who is not supposed to say anything about Minnesota, and for someone who it would seem is at a great risk of being imprisoned for going to Minnesota, he seems the source of a lot of information about all this, right?
ANSWER. OLD CAVE SPEAKS CAREFULLY. HE CAN SPEAK OF MINNESOTA WITHOUT MENTION OF THE NAME.
Question: But certainly any smart government spy would be able to figure this out? Also, he must attract some attention if he is so well known that others, like the Nazis, for example, who seek him out for help in dealing with Minnesota experiences. What do you say, Dr. 58?
ANSWER: YOU ARE NOT A COMPLEX THINKER.
Question: What do you mean?
ANSWER: YOU DO NOT THINK IN COMPLEXITY. THE GOVERNMENT CERTAINLY KNOWS THE TRUTH ABOUT OLD CAVE, PERHAPS THEY USE HIM TO THEIR OWN ENDS.
Question: Ah! I underestimate you, Dr. 58! Yes, you think like a chess player! Always several moves ahead! So what you’re saying is, the government probably is well aware of the entire truth about Father Reston Vromin, yet they allow him a certain leeway to ply his trade, so to speak, and they monitor him so that they also can learn inside information they need about strange goings on. Right?
ANSWER: YES.
Question: And as I think about this further, I can imagine that since Old Cave is such a magnet for certain people -- mostly socmals who get into Minnesota trouble -- government agents can more easily identify socmal trouble makers lurking in society, if they give Old Cave some space, right?
ANSWER: PERHAPS.
Question: Would you say your American government is oppressive, Dr. 58?
ANSWER: NO, ONLY WATCHFUL.
Question; Watchful of what? That having to do with Minnesota mostly?
ANSWER: OF MINNESOTA AND OTHER SOCMAL TROUBLE, AND FOREIGN SPIES.
Question: Well, the Americans of your world have achieved something that seems nothing less than spectacularly remarkable, in my opinion. They somehow have managed to form an organized country with the most dangerous, ancient and powerful mystery in the world right within their border -- and they have managed to live in a kind of stasis with this … thing … in their midst.
ANSWER: YES.
Question: Anyway, I think the word you choose for the Nazi satellite incidents -- the word disaster, doesn’t quite do the whole thing justice. This turned out to more than a disaster, but a gigantic debacle of the highest order, would you agree? And mostly psychologically I would think?
ANSWER: YES.
Question: I can see how these incidents must have brought the Nazi regime to its knees. Did it?
ANSWER: YOU COULD SAY THAT. NAZI GLOBAL POWER WAS DEVASTATED. THEY WERE REQUIRED TO TURN INWARD TO REPAIR THEIR SOCIETY.
Question: Yes, and the very central element of Nazi culture -- technological determinism -- must have suffered a scathing blow. I mean, these events showed the very real limits to what technology could achieve in the face of powerful forces of the unknown, am I correct?
ANSWER: YES, EXACTLY.
Question: Had Nazi power been on the rise in recent years?
ANSWER: YES, FOR MANY YEARS, ESPECIALLY SINCE THEIR PURGE OF THE EBURNEANS. THEY GAINED GREAT POWER.
Question: Ah, back to them. Dr. 58, we are very tired now, but perhaps next we can talk about this pogrom the Nazis served upon the Eburneans -- which you say had something to do with some kind of “flood of horrors” involving the Graditch Chax, right?
ANSWER: YES.
Question: Okay, well thank you then, Dr. 58. Bye for now.
ANSWER: GOOD-BYE.
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